Downtown Raleigh’s skyline will change dramatically in the next several years with the addition of new towers, particularly in the southern end. Are you excited?
UPDATE 10/08/2008:
First of the Edison updates:
UPDATE 07/20/2007:
He is an updated version of the future Raleigh Skyline rendering. It reflects a more current version of what we might see in 2008 and beyond.
Closer:
The current version of Raleigh (2006):
The future rendering of Raleigh:
A less cartoony look at the rendering:
Discuss!
Created
on Sunday, October 29th, 2006 in the category Illustrations, Labs.
Comments RSS Feed.
March 2nd, 2010 at 3:24 pm
yep you are right man… its official, raleigh is wack as hell!
March 2nd, 2010 at 5:30 pm
not surprised, but very disappointed. frickin idiots on that board. i want to punch some of them in the head with their ridiculous arguments. it’s a $20 a year tax on homeowners that doesnt even start for 2 years. so instead we’re gonna watch another project for downtown get watered down or canceled, and throw away the potential savings and the money already spent. im sure when meeker is out of office things will get even worse. i wish he could just rule as a dictator….
March 2nd, 2010 at 5:46 pm
Downtown lost a nice tower thanks to these city council members.
March 3rd, 2010 at 10:37 am
Before y’all start getting into a bad mood, let’s take another look at it… The project is not dead. There is a good chance it will return, and hopefully with a better financing plan. It is not about the annual increase, more than the fact that the mayor and the city council didn’t exactly do a good job presenting the need for this project. I had a discussion with a former city council member, who happens to be a supporter of this project, and she agreed that the city council did a poor job in making a case for this building.
One thing I do not understand is why do we keep repeating the “savings” in construction costs argument… There is no such thing when our city is in debt. If someone offers you a high-end Ferrari for half the price, will you still go out there and buy it? The answer is “No”. Our credit is not good enough – hence the property tax increase – and if some of you think that building this high-rise will be the solution to a debt that approaches $1 billion, then we are a city that will face far worse challenges. People are not prepared for the financial mess that Meeker and others want to drag us into. So, let’s take it easy and instead of putting pressure on the 4 members who voted “No”, put some pressure on the ones who voted “No”. Make them work harder to address the real issues, be that the final cost or the financing terms.
As a contrast, Wake County is moving forward with the new County Justice Center. The N&O had a great article on how this project is moving without tax increases and how the county leaders silently worked on this project without much opposition. Maybe Meeker can learn something from them. The new Justice Center took 10 years in planning, and while we may not be exactly satisfied with the final design, County leaders are delivering, without much ado.
Nothing is lost. Let’s keep pressuring both sides and not focus on the opposition, only. Nobody in the latter debates the need for new HQ and they all hope to see something major on the proposed location, except from a private developer.
March 3rd, 2010 at 4:04 pm
What exactly IS the final design of the justice center anyway? The last thing I saw led me to believe they were using a less impressive design.
March 3rd, 2010 at 4:28 pm
go to newsandobserver.com and it has it up there.
March 3rd, 2010 at 9:44 pm
I just came back from Seattle, and WOW! There must have been over a dozen cranes of all sizes cluttering the skyline. It is truly inspiring, especially in this economy. It is unbelievable what’s going on over there, especially the nearby city of Bellevue. I wish Raleigh was the same way…
March 4th, 2010 at 10:09 am
The ridiculous thing is to hear about “design” complains – this came from a brief personal conversation with one of the members that cast a “No” vote. I am not sure that design is the issue here, although most safety concerns are valid. Hopefully, Meeker will lead a new effort to address safety and financing issues, so he can get the 5th vote he wants so much. John Odom is probably the best person to approach, without saying that the rest cannot possibly be convinced. I agree with what James West said: “a setback is an opportunity for a comeback” – something along those lines. Yes, we need to see this project moving forward. Maybe the city can consider the split of this project in two parts, but instead of reducing the size of the tower, we can have the Fire Dept and the city government offices moving in there, with Raleigh PD HQ being in a separate location…
Gene, there are still cities that amaze us with the skyline boost they get, even during tough times. Austin is also a good example. However, the question remains: how many of these projects will remain viable in the future? Yes, the skyline will get the boost, but when will be the next boom? I must agree, though. Raleigh needs to get its act together and leave places like Bellevue in the dust, instead of the other way around. Not that Bellevue doesn’t deserve respect, in contrary. Raleigh is still a larger city and gets better grades than Bellevue. Seattle is a very different level, though, so I won’t say anything about it.
March 4th, 2010 at 11:59 am
raleigh wont get there the way its going i can tell you this… im so disappointed! if i wasnt from here i would talk so much s#%@ right about now.
March 4th, 2010 at 12:34 pm
I think the reason they are talking about Savings is that Meeker beleives this will need to be built and will be built int eh next few years. SO, if you look at it from a foregone conclusion, it is cheaper to build now with better pricing than 5 years from now with much higher pricing.
I think that contributed to the lack of presenting a good argument for the place. They just assumed it would be built and went from there. Now, I will say that they fact the the council (with many of hte same members) has voted to spend $20 plus million so far might have been pushing to think it was more or less a dumb deal. (and as more of a conservative leaner, I can;t say I am too happy spending that much money on something and then get nothing to show for it.) I also beleive that Raleigh needs this building, or at least something similar due to growth and poor facilities going back years. I have no problem spending money on something needed. I also prefer Tax money be spent as close as possible to where it was taken. Small Federal Government and larger local. Again, this meets that criteria, IMO. And while I don’t neccesarrily beleive that goverment should dump money on make work projects,if this was needed any time soon, it is better from an economic development and business climate standpoint to do it now, when the construction sector is really hurting.
I think there were plenty of good arguements to have been made on this thing on pretty much all sides of the issue and the fact that they did little to none of this is why it was tanked. Again, poor leadership from the leader of the City of Raleigh!
March 4th, 2010 at 4:03 pm
laryea, if you were not from Raleigh, you would probably not give a damn about its skyline :ROTFLMAO:
Lee L, I am in agreement with what you said. And I also agree with John Odom’s proposal – assuming I understood correctly. Put this baby to vote after making a strong case for this project and see what the taxpayers would say. Although I do not want to hear anything about a new property tax increase, I would settle for it if we were to get this wonderful project. I am confident that the residents in our city would look at this project as a much needed addition and the 5th vote would come. Still, I would not rush to “attack” Bonner Gaylord. He is right in MANY levels, but if there was a developer who could bring us something more impressive, by all means, build the new HQ somewhere else and save on the infrastructure enhancements.
Another possibility: Find a few good developers who can [hopefully] build 3/4 of the block, surround the new safety center from the West, North-West and North with taller buildings, and fortify it so no human outside those who work there can access it. The new city hall may become part of this high-rise – yes, make it taller by another 5-6 floors – and use the taxes from the 3 towers towards the public safety center. Maybe it sounds hard to accomplish, but it is doable, especially if we make it a goal for the next 5 years. By then, the economy will have taken a turn for the better, I hope.
March 13th, 2010 at 9:43 pm
raleigh is small i guess thats becuz i live in charlotte nc you wouldnt believe how fast it has grown since 2006 now charlotte is as big as atlanta while raleigh is as big as charlotte in o maybe 2002
March 14th, 2010 at 1:50 am
TO FDSIVFRaleigh..compared to Charlotte…really isnt small. Charlotte is NOT a Large city. you say Charlotte is as big as ATL..okay..keep dreaming. Charlotte strives to be ATL while Raleigh seeks its OWN identity. I ALWAYS hear how Charlotte is “just like” or “goning to be like” Atlanta…that is SOOOO lame. Raleigh and Charlotte are the same..medium sized cities…compared to NYC..LA..Chicago…hell…go to DAEGU and BUSAN in South Korea….you will see that besides a skyl9ne….Charlotte looks like a big city..but really isnt
March 14th, 2010 at 11:35 am
LOL charlotte is nowhere near as big as atlanta! charlotte’s skyline might resemble (just) the midtown section of atlanta, but thats about where the comparisons stop. it’s a cluster of tall buildings with no real city.
March 14th, 2010 at 5:46 pm
Think of Charlotte as a smaller Seattle and Raleigh as a smaller Portland. In both cases, remove the urbanity factor, in which both Charlotte and Raleigh fail miserably when compared to Seattle and Portland, respectively. Maybe some day both NC cities will have fixed the problems we inherited from the past, but until then we have a long way to go.
Atlanta is simply a huge sprawling metro, but it has both the population and image to place itself in the big cities league. Let’s be fair to Charlotte. It has the population and the vision to become a better city than Atlanta – many would argue that it is a better city, already – but it will be another 20-30 years before we compare Charlotte to today’s Atlanta. However, I would not consider Atlanta a world-class city, I am sorry. This is what separates, in my opinion, real big cities from the up-and-coming and wanna-be big cities. Raleigh may never reach that level, but I will be happy to see it becoming more like Portland, minus a few things that I don’t care to see, like cost of living and the amount of grit you find in Portland. Guess you have to take the good with the bad, in every case.
One more thing: Charlotte’s population in 1990 was about 395,000 people (Raleigh was about 212,000 then), approximately the same with Raleigh’s population 1-2 years ago. Sure, aggressive annexing helps, but that is not the point of our discussion. The fact remains: Charlotte is much larger than Raleigh and will remain so for many years to come. Where both cities are at the same level is the missing urbanity, contrary to some people’s efforts to say otherwise
March 14th, 2010 at 8:32 pm
I am really impressed with Charlotte’s skyline. It is one of my favorites.The new Duke Energy Tower really makes a statement.
March 15th, 2010 at 5:40 am
Moved here five years ago for wife’s job, from Atlanta, Charolotte does not even come close to being Atlanta, as an ex banker, I can say the only reason Charlotte has a skyline is the status of having the tallest building. Banking jobs are mostly low paying, do you think Bank America would be there if they were not saving on labor cost over San Francisco. We are now retiring to Phoenix, which has a downtown and a Financial District, and can not wait, I love the South and will miss the green trees, but Raleigh needs to make up its mind what it wants to be. And if Raleigh wanted to be bigger than Charlotte, just annex all the county property in wake, the population for Wake vs Mecklenburg is almost the same It is too bad the leaders of Raleigh are so wishy washy and cant decide what to do with this town.
March 15th, 2010 at 7:52 am
rodr you are very right ,raleigh leaders dont know what they want to do at all. whoever is comparing charlotte to atlanta really doesnt have a clue either! atlanta’s metro is almost three times that of charlottes and yes their midtown alone is almost larger than all of dt charlotte. the thing about atlanta is that it is TOO sprawled just like raleigh and charlotte. i think that is a southern trait because jacksonville, nashville, birmingham, and oklahoma city are all like that… jacksonville being the worst case. it takes entirely too damn long to go from one place to the next in jv. after living in newark for almost two years it is very hard to consider even atlanta a great big city. i will admit that atlanta probably has the best skyline for a city its size but lets be honest… atlantas metro covers more than 20 counties with only four that really have most of the pop(fulton, dekalb, gwinnet, and cobb). there are more people in the northern new jersey area in about 20 sm than there are in about half the atlanta metro. there are a lot of flaws there just like there are in charlotte and raleigh, the only difference is they have way more to offer because they have a much larger population. i think fdsivf left that comment just to piss all of us off really because he hasnt responded yet and it seems like one of those comments that wasnt well thought through at all. charlotte will always remain larger than raleigh but i think that
March 15th, 2010 at 11:21 am
Who cares why or how Charlotte has such a nice skyline? I wish Raeigh could find a reason for having a nice skyline. Banking, Govt, Tech or SOMETHING!!
March 15th, 2010 at 3:08 pm
Lo, let me try to answer the “who cares” part. First of all, Charlotte is a North Carolina city that has done many great things for itself – except for the urban sprawl. Looking at Charlotte should not be out of jealousy, or hatred, but rather out of wanting to learn from success stories, and I am not talking about skylines. Seeing how a successful light rail line is used to lure additional developments around the stations may serve as a great way for Raleigh to plan ahead. Observing how Charlotte-based businesses jump into the opportunity to boost Uptown is also admirable (i.e. BofA, Duke Energy)
Another reason why we should care is because Charlotte is a North Carolina municipality, also helped by state government incentives when it comes to relocations. Can Raleigh get a little more aggressive in that department, so we can lure additional corporations with some help from the state government (once the crisis is over)? I think we could and should. Since we are just getting our feet wet in the finance world, we may attract several smaller banks in the beginning, but I hope there will be a day when we’ll be able to compete with places like Charlotte. Until then, we can learn a few things from the Queen City.
Just my 2 cents…
March 15th, 2010 at 3:45 pm
Good points Ernest.
March 15th, 2010 at 10:33 pm
I would love to one day be able to compare Raleigh to Portland. Portland is a very well planned city with a dense urban center and minimal sprawl. Unfortunately what we have here in Raleigh, along with Cary and Durham in the larger metropolitan area, is a LOT of sprawl. Fortunately, efforts are focusing more and more on bringing additional density to downtown and in the long run we can hope to correct the course this area has seen over the past 20 years. Raleigh has also had to compete with development efforts in RTP, Cary, and Durham – which we cannot complain too much about, as Raleigh and the area as a whole has obviously benefited from the regional growth. Fortunately, with the direction downtown Raleigh has gone in the last 5 years, it’s become more and more “hip” to be located downtown. I would hope that land owners and developers don’t get too greedy when the economy can stimulate more downtown growth again, as I think that downtown has to potential to really boom over the next decade once we move past this economic downturn.
March 15th, 2010 at 11:48 pm
i wanted to move to portland before i decided on raleigh. it is a cool city. it also is drizzly as hell, has homeless people (esp teens) all over the place, and a crap ton of unemployment. everything’s got trade-offs….
i think in the long run raleigh will be better off than portland.
March 17th, 2010 at 1:35 pm
It’s hard trying to compare Raleigh and Portland. I lived in Raleigh for 6 years while going to school at NC State and I’ve been in Portland the last 2 years. I love both cities, but they are completely different. Portland is so well planned. Most of the city (except getting up into the west hills) is on a grid pattern and divided into 5 major areas – NE, SE, NW, SW, N. This is probably the main reason public transportation (Buses, Light Rail, Streetcar and – Bike Lanes!) works so well here. It seems just the opposite in Raleigh. Other than the Wolfline.. I took a CAT bus 2-3 times in 6yrs. Now I take the bus, MAX(light rail) or ride my bike to work almost every day. It’d be hard to do that in Raleigh.
As far as downtown/skyline goes, again I think it has a lot to do with better planning. Over the last few years the city & developers have invested a lot of time and money planning and building more mixed-use buildings downtown and in the Pearl District. Although they can be absurdly expensive, the city requires some of the buildings to have smaller/less expensive units and even place some apts. below market rate. Now, that might not sound good to everyone but IT WORKS! It’s gets more people living downtown and socio-economic mix it provides… well, I think most people love it. It’s also a great way to get a younger people close to work. There are also TONS of apartment/studio buildings on the edge of downtown and many older, large houses that have been subdivided. Anyway, getting off topic. Both cities are great in their own right.
March 17th, 2010 at 2:44 pm
EA, allow me a “correction”. It would be impossible to compare Raleigh to Portland and I would never dare doing so
The only reason I brought the Charlotte/Raleigh and Seattle/Portland comparison is because Charlotte and Seattle shoot for the sky, while Portland and Raleigh seem to pay more attention to smaller urban infills and less on the image. I would think that Charlotte could look at Seattle for inspiration, while Raleigh could look at Portland.
I love what Portland has done with Pearl District and I hope that both Glenwood South and Warehouse District could use it as a model, particularly as pertaining to the new buildings. Prices at the Pearl District can be insane and I don’t want that for DT Raleigh, but the latter is also expensive for what it offers. Please, y’all, bear with me as I am trying to put a few parallels in place:
PEARL DISTRICT
The transformation started back in the 80’s, although the two major steps took place in 1994 and 2000. First, Hoyt Street Properties acquired and redeveloped the 34-acre Burlington Northern rail yard; a $600 million urban redevelopment project. Then, a Portland developer – who says local boys cannot do it – Gerding/Edlen purchased the Blitz-Weinhard Brewery and redeveloped it into housing and retail, while preserving the historical aspect of the property. Probably, this would scream Durham more than Raleigh.
WAREHOUSE DISTRICT/GLENWOOD SOUTH
The transformation begun in the early 90’s, mostly with entertainment destinations occupying renovated warehouses. 510 Glenwood was a pivotal project back then, although momentum was picked up for Glenwood South with projects like Quorum Center, 222 Glenwood, West At North and Solas, although every project counts (i.e. Park Deveraux, Hudson, Hue, Campbell School of Law).
My point is, we do not need to be concerned about getting a tall skyline right now. We can be an attractive place simply by filling up a few gaps and improving transportation, at least by connecting nearby areas to downtown – a light rail would be nice. Then, we can dream big, once city leaders take several smaller things off their plate and focus on attracting a few major corporations to DT Raleigh.
Sorry for yet-another lengthy post
March 17th, 2010 at 3:29 pm
but ernest if you fill up the empty gaps with non tall buildings then eventually there wont be any room left in dt raleigh to build the dreamy tall buildings… right? raleigh already doesnt have a large area for dt development really so imo i would want to see at least three or four more tall buildings before it gets too late..
March 17th, 2010 at 7:09 pm
Build up high! I like height. I think it changes the perception of this fast growing city. We need more companies downtown to accomplish this. I thought the Radio Shack HQ would have been a step in the right direction. Seems our Governor is spending her time recruiting companies/jobs for Charlotte. I would like to see a similar effort with success from officials for Raleigh other than for a new police station.
March 18th, 2010 at 12:00 am
I will be the last person to suggest smaller buildings all over downtown. There are transitional areas that are well suited for this purpose. Instead of building in the core, we can build in the outskirts of downtown. Even buildings between 10 and 20 stories would make a huge difference there. That is what I meant by “filling up a few gaps”. Areas such as Glenwood South (West side), North and South End, South Park, and even districts that will eventually become downtown, such as Capital Blvd from Peace Str to the Wake Forest Rd exit and South of MLK Blvd. There are parcels that could be filled with a series of mid-rises and smaller high-rises, offering the urban scale that even some of our small-town thinking officials could not resist. It would make it easier to propose a 39-story Glenwood One when there are already 2-3 buildings around 20 floors nearby.
Recruiting businesses to Raleigh – particularly downtown – would require state, city and county governments to cooperate and synchronize their efforts. When Cary, with only $75,000 of incentives on its part, manages to attract Deutsche Bank’s data center and Raleigh’s leaders argue over spilled milk, what do we expect? Sure, a data center isn’t the same with a regional operations center, but we should be able to attract at least something of importance. Our governor has a lot on her plate and I am sure that recruiting businesses in DT Raleigh is nowhere near her list of priorities. Unfortunately, the state government has not been a good citizen when it comes to urban planning, let alone a cheerleader for DT Raleigh.
March 18th, 2010 at 8:05 am
ok i see what your saying ernest, i agree totally then.
March 18th, 2010 at 11:05 am
I am glad i came here today and read some of the Raleigh/Portland comparisons.
I’m probably leaving Raleigh for Portland this year.
March 18th, 2010 at 5:48 pm
well I can say one thing that Raleigh has that Charlotte nor Portland have now….we have an H&M…that’s impressive on a small scale….it shows we will at least be a much better dressed city than those! lol…Charlotte and Portland are not even expected to get an H&M in the next five years even,,,,I work there now!
March 18th, 2010 at 6:38 pm
gd… good luck! the unemployment and underemployment there is crazy, and it’s definitely more expensive than Raleigh. i wanted to move there instead of here, but it just wasnt gonna work out.
NCSUkid… hell yes! can’t wait for the crowds to die down a little and then my wife and i will be on a shopping spree. i’ve been in withdrawl since leaving boston
March 18th, 2010 at 9:04 pm
Raleigh also has the only Bahama Breeze in NC, closest ones are in NOVA and Atlanta….Raleigh got the bid over Charlotte years ago….so before everybody preaches CHARLOTTE CHARLOTTE, people need to realize that there are several global conglomerate businesses that are here that are not in most places….
March 19th, 2010 at 7:58 am
well you know we had saks fifth ave about two or three years before charlotte but they got the ikea. one of my friends in denver cant believe we got the h&m over denver lol. like i said before i am a NORTH CAROLINA man. im proud of any city that represents the cack! i just know that raleigh needs serious density in dt and more apt buildings instead of condos and we will be fine. greensboro could use a few too, their dt doesnt resemble a city of 260,000 people either. imo charlotte, asheville, and winston score good in the dt department while, raleigh, durham, and greensboro could use some assistance seriously with raleigh being the number one case since it is the capitol.
March 19th, 2010 at 7:59 am
Jeff: I want to get on with Nike. I have two good connects there and they are always looking people for their legal department. I’m going to visit soon and from there, make the decision about moving. Regardless, whether it be Portland, Seattle or Washington DC, im getting the hell away from Raleigh as fast as i can. this place depresses me now.
And bragging about how Raleigh has an H&M is like bragging we have the worlds ugliest clothes. that store is incredibly bad.
March 19th, 2010 at 8:04 am
imo raleigh is beautiful landscape wise but gets a fat F in planning. for example why are there no lights on 440 and 40 in the raleigh city limit? that just really erks me i cant lie! even durham went and put lights on 85 a few years ago and greensboro, winston, and charlotte all have lights on 85 and 40 in the city limit part. to me this is bad planning seriously, i’ve never seen a city not put lights on the interstate in the city limit part. it makes the city look country as hell!
March 19th, 2010 at 9:23 am
In all honesty, most cities would get an “F” for planning. But let’s be fair, when our area grew fast most people cheered and got a bit too confident. Very few individuals had the right idea about good planning – I exclude those who simply wanted Raleigh to remain a small town – but this is the case with every major metro in the country. That is, sunbelt metros, not older, established areas.
Speaking of planning, I anticipate to see a lot more interest in high-rise development once the Raleigh 2030 plan is finished. There are incentives for those who build high-density near TOD’s, including high-rises. Of course, the entire downtown qualifies as such area, therefore I expect to see more interest. Putting rental units is a noble idea and a great goal to achieve, but I can’t imagine any high-rise being built for that purpose. Which is why I feel that rental buildings can easily be placed near the edges of downtown and into transitional areas. The problem is that many of them are cheap looking, and it they are not, they are very expensive
You are better off buying a small condo, seriously.
March 19th, 2010 at 10:35 am
good point ernest but you know what raleigh tries to outdo itself sometimes. they need to build apts in dt that are affordable. raleigh doesnt have enough in dt right now to charge people 900 and 1000 dollars for rent. dc, ny, atl, miami, i can see but raleigh… no! i never understood why raleigh likes to charge so much for what they have to offer. when i was in charlotte they have affordable apt in dt… around 750 or so which isnt bad but the ones in raleigh are crazy high. to me this = no sense!
March 19th, 2010 at 12:58 pm
Laryea, agree totally with you on the topic of freeway lighting. At the very least, the entire length of 440, and I-40 from at least Crossroads to the 440 split in southeast Raleigh ought to have streetlamps. Especially now with the energy-saving technology of LED lighting that’s available now, and moreso with Cree right in our backyard. Meantime, it’s 4 lanes of pitch black road ribbon at night, and in inclement weather – well, it’s just that much worse. That’s always been a touchy subject with me.
March 19th, 2010 at 7:31 pm
Make downtown affordable with 750 dollar per month rent and you will do nothing but run off the people with high payings jobs. They will do what was done 30-40 years ago when downtowns across the country became ghost towns or high crime areas and that is run for the suburbs. It would be nothing but history repeating itself. Sad but true.