hey that’s pretty cool! it’s interesting to see Raleigh from that angle, too.

As always, very nice

Makes NH look small!

Matt,

Let me skip the usual comments about your photography skills, as the views is the main focus of this series. Let me say that the skyline looks really nice from CAPTRUST Tower. Sure, it is small and underwhelming, but the angle is really nice and we get to see all the major buildings. It makes me more inpatient to see The Edison completed, as it will offer tremendous depth (and height) to the skyline from this angle.

North Hills East is also coming along just fine. Sure, it is a work in progress… A work that has just begun, and the there is a ton of work before it gets completed, but it is surely becoming a very attractive development. I do hope that Kane will manage to build several high-rises, as tall as the city allows (35 floors at the moment), as they will offer fantastic views of the skyline and densify that area.

Thanks for sharing these great images, and thanks to the person who offered you access

Ernest,

You’re dead on about the angle and Edison impatience. These shots really make me wish RBC tower was more vertical and less unattractive. Once Edison is built and “the big gap” as I like to call it starts getting filled, we’ll really have something then.

Another interesting thing is to see how the gap between the CBD and Glenwood South will be filled – JRD, is this the gap you are talking about? The banner image for this series shows clearly how Hillsborough Street can be utilized better: with high-rises that exceed 500ft. The section between Salisbury Str and Glenwood Ave will be golden, IF high-rise development expands into the Warehouse District. To me, two projects can boost the skyline towards the West: One Glenwood and whatever will end up going at the N&O block. If we get in these two locations anything above 500ft – and chances are we will – the skyline will be off the hook.

Let me stop here, before my imagination runs any wilder

Yes, thats the gap I speak of. This is why I think the Public Safety center is a must (aside form the actual real needs for it). That will definitely push it west, also SECU hqs will also contribute slightly I think. Is One Glenwood even still on?

The photos from the Captrust building are excellent. Thanks Matt.

VERY NICE PICS!!! What is the latest on the Edison Project?

C BEST, there are no real updates on any of the projects that we anticipate. Outside The Hillsborough and Lafayette, the rest are still good. The Edison, being as complex project as it is, will only need a little time before we see it rising above ground. My guess is that the developer is trying – much like any other developer – to lure a major office tenant before any official groundbreaking takes place. Financing doesn’t seem to be the issue, but without a major tenant it will be hard to see any activity at the site. In general, your guess is as good as anyone’s, but the project is still solid and there is preliminary work taking place behind the scenes.

Wow…it’s amazing to see where you live from 17 floors up. Grew up around North Hills, and it is awesome to see what it has become, and what the view is from the 17th floor.

p.s.–from parts of Rowan Dr. and Knollwood Rd. you can see downtown, or at least the RBC Center lights…it’s pretty cool.

The Radio Shack hq wanted to move. They were thinking about raleigh and mabey they could use the edison as there building

I was ecstatic about the possibility of Radio Shack moving its HQ here, but I was told from a reliable source that this may be a trick similar to Boeing’s, so they can get more out Texas. Unless my source wanted to keep a secret, it doesn’t seem that Radio Shack will be going anywhere. The incentives they will need to move here will not be worth it, so neither the local nor the state government will do anything – can’t blame them. However, if they decided in DT Raleigh’s favor, I couldn’t see better place for them than The Edison.

ERNEST,

Thanks for the update on the Edison project!

ERNEST,

Has a General Contractor been awarded the Edison Project??

Not that I know of, but given the size and complexity of the project I would not anticipate any quick decisions.

cross your fingers people today the public safety center either gets a go or gets go-ing back to the drawing board. pray these clowns dont f%&k this up!

Yes, pray that they vote yes without any tax increases and bankrupting the city I think that the building is fine as designed and should not cut corners, but I am also sure the city can reduce the costs by removing features we can add later. Somehow, I don’t think public art is needed in a building like that. I have no problem with the private bathrooms for the people high in the hierarchy, as they will be needed during extended crisis. However, mayor Meeker should stop talking about any savings at this moment… When tax payers pick up the bill, there is no such thing as “savings” for the city.

Ha, it would actually look nicer if the corners were rounded off. All the buildings in downtown are too boxy. Yes, Ernest, I know that’s not actually what u mint but dt Raleigh needs abuilding with a dome to make some diversity in the style.

Ben, I agree with you. I do wish to see a little more diverse architecture in DT Raleigh. Quite frankly, I am disappointed with the fact that outside a couple of NYC rip-off’s (One Progress Plaza and 333 Fayetteville) that you find in many cities, there is nothing truly inspiring. Sure, we have a few decent mid-rises, but when it comes to high-rise development we are far behind

Love the Fairgrounds, so sick, wouldnt think it would be a decent view of it but wow

I completely support the Raleigh Downtown Police/Public Safety Center. It should be built as tall, and as elaborate as the renderings show. I do not live in the City of Raleigh, so the tax increases dont bother me one bit

Bill, I wish there was a way to combine the new County Justice Center and the city’s proposed Public Safety Center into one building that would reach almost twice as high. Or, place both towers on the same [side of the] block, if possible. I know, it is tough for city and county governments to engage into some creative deals, but some day we may see that. I guess this is one of the positive things that come from the merging of city-county governments, like in Mecklenburg County.

how can you turn something like the public safety center into something political thats my question? this shouldnt be political it should be a priority!

I agree, which is why it is not a political issue, except for a handful of people from both sides of the isle who have reasons to argue “for” or “against” it. Again, nobody argues about the need, but merely the timing. You wanna bet that once property tax increase is removed as an option the reaction will be nearly non-existent? There MUST be a way to finance at least part of this MUCH NEEDED project through federal funding. This is not pork spending, or an earmark. There has to be a way to get some money from the Dept. of Homeland Security, or other similar federal entities… Any of our brilliant [local] politicians who may have connections care to help? PLEASE, and while you are at it, make this building taller

if this thing gets scrapped, pushed back for years, or scaled down, im going to be really pissed…

Its going to go through in some form or another. If its something we need, then we gotta build it. I think I heard they were talking about different locations.

A delay will not hurt my feelings, as much as a scale down. I think that the latter is not the issue, as much as what goes inside the building, Like JRD said, it will be built in some form or another. The need for space will dictate the size, but any extras – and there are things that we can remove from the plan, at least for now – would raise opposition and stall the project, and for a good reason. If the city leaders want to spend over $700,000 on public art, they must be insane… Take that money and use it to offer incentives to companies to move downtown. That would raise our DT tax base and possibly put some of that money into future additions to the Public Safety Center. I think it can happen if we get a little creative. One million here, a few millions there, we can salvage this vision without sacrificing its most essential components.

Did I mention that I would love to see this building get taller

How did you get that picture of the Fairgrounds and Ariport and why can you only see trees? AMAZING!

The pics are great…Raleigh is finally coming into its own……..Soon, downtown won’t be the only area with a skyline. Midtown Raleigh is doing it up!!!!!!!

yo the ncdot finally emailed me a response as to why there are no lights on 440 and this is what they had to say

i really wanted to paste it but for some reason this link wont allow it so basically they said:

there were improvements done to it in 02 and instead of putting lights they decided to put planters because they felt it would be more sutable instead of lights. they said the whole point was to make it easy for traveling vehicles to see the shoulder and highway barrier not to provide illumination to motorist for brokedown vehicles. they also said that as of now there are no future plans to put lights on 440.

laryea, no surprise in the DOT’s response… Lame, like I expected it

you said it ernest LAME!!!!!!! NO EXCUSE AT ALL i guess they will wait until something really bad happens before they do something.

laryea, I forgot to say this: Thanks for taking the initiative Too bad NC DOT can’t recognize the need for highway lighting as much as we do, but there is a way to fix this… Are you ready? Build high-rises along both sides of the highway and they will provide the lighting On a serious not, North Hills does a good job providing some light when you pass through that portion of the highway.

good one ernest yea that will illuminate it better lol. hey somebody had to ask em but, o well…

The City Counsel is suppose to look into THE PUBLIC SAFETY CENTER again next TUESDAY April 6. Mayor Meeker has said there would not be a tax increase.

Also everyone please E-MAIL JOHN ODOM to vote YES for the project. THANKS Dwight

Does anyone know the status of the SECU tower allegedly being built by Green Square? I would’ve thought they would have started building by now, end of 2009 actually. Is there a point person from SECU to contact even? I feel like this project gets no press, and I start to wonder if it’s being delayed.

I agree with Dwight. John Odom is the only one of the opposing votes that can be changed. He is NOT against the project, just against the exclusion of the public approval and the tax increase. However, there is a catch: the cost of the building will be a debt that the city will have to carry as a burden for many years to come. I encourage you to present a positive case for the proposed Public Safety Center and its benefits – better land use included. Try to avoid any negative tone. In other words, be firm, but diplomatic, at the same time.

NC SECU’s building is going to begin as soon as Green Square is well under way. In fact, I see them digging more and more in the spot where this building will go, which tells me that pretty soon we’ll see another crane No delays due to backing out, just waiting for construction of Green Square to reach a certain stage.

charles meeker said that they would have to push off a few other city projects and build this one since this is top priority… is this the catch you’re talking about ernest?

This is one of the many catches. We are talking about the type of debt that can’t be paid off without taxes, even after the reduction in services and the down-sizing of other projects (not necessarily buildings). Of course, the valid argument about a high-rise structure housing emergency services is tough to debate, but personally I do not feel that we have much to worry about. Federal Buildings are normally the primary targets for terrorist attacks. Nor do I feel that a tornado is going to come by and demolish the building.

I do appreciate that mayor Meeker is willing to take a good look at this project from our perspective. Nobody wants to hear of any increases in expenses right now. Sure, I would hate to see a significant decrease in services, and it sure feels good to have the police HQ near where I live – I can walk there in less than 10 minutes – but it is also time to move on and take a few calculated risks, even if we need to wait for another year before we start digging.

Again, John Odom is probably the only vote you can count on. He has no high-rise phobia, as far as I know, and his name is already established, regardless of how you may feel about him. His arguments were not based on hot air, and now he has one less reason to cast a “No” vote. Any polite and to the point emails would certainly help him see that we count on his vote to move this city forward. Pointing the benefits to our emergency response agencies would be more important than anything relating to the skyline improvements, but you don’t need me to tell you that

I love how North Hills looks as you drive by on 440. The fact that the Captrust Tower is sitting on that hill makes it look really tall! I’m eager to see what will soon join in in that development.

Interesting response from NCDOT, Laryea. I guess my response to NCDOT would have been something along the lines of, “Oh, yes, the planters do a much better job of improving visibility than street lights ever would.” No, seriously, I do love the look of the plants along 440. I would never suggest ripping those out in favor of lights – but there are right-of-ways and shoulders on both sides of the freeway that can accommodate lighting. Where 440 is specifically concerned, I have no idea when the roadway was constructed or when improvements (barriers and landscaping) were made – but it’s safe to say it was probably a considerable time ago when traffic volume was less and Raleigh was a much smaller city than it is now. But at least we all now know where NCDOT stands on the issue – they haven’t given any thought to it, nor do they plan to. I would guess it would take some initiative on the city’s part to get things moving in that regard.

Ernest, I think downtown Raleigh is safe from tornados – not enough mobile home parks around to attract one. (insert cymbal crash here)

Question, they’re calling this area “midtown” Raleigh, which I guess is supposed to invoke Midtown Manhattan. Does anyone see the CAPTRUST building eventually spurring more high rise development? I mean, does anyone see it spurring (I have no timetable for this, it could be in the next 10 years or the next 50, whatever) buildings taller than itself? If this is really the “new” downtown and becomes a rival for urbanity in the Triangle, does anyone see it migrating down 440 to the old North Hills Mall and down Wake Forest Rd. to Downtown? Personally I feel like this is the only way this area could see any urban development. I live in Fuquay and I don’t venture up to this part of Raleigh much, but from everything I know I feel like the Wake Forest/Capital Blvd corridor could eventually support some bigger buildings. This being the case it would be ideal for some form of mass transit (be it BRT or LR or whatever).

Steve, unless I’m mistaken, I believe there are plans for more midrise buildings to eventually join the Captrust tower in North Hills East sometime in the future. I think “Midtown” is an appropriate name for the area – whether or not you choose to include the Crabtree Valley retail area in the Midtown designation seems to be a matter of personal preference. Most people will remember that not so long ago, a 40+ story mixed use building was planned for this area (in the form the Soleil Center), so it’s not a stretch to guess that one day Captrust will be overtaken by something taller nearby. I’m not as sharp as some others on what city zoning allows for new building heights outside of downtown, or for this particular area. I wouldn’t mind seeing some more mid-rises popup along this 440 corridor, anchored by North Hills and stretching over to Capital and Glenwood both directions – but I would never bet on it rivaling downtown as the new urban core.

Good point about the possibility of the future of the Wake Forest Road corridor. There are still many portions of Six Forks and Wake Forest Roads that are primarily single family residential, though. I would not expect rapid redevelop anytime soon, unless something were to surprise me. I personally think the priority focus on redeveloping any area north of DTR should be the Capital Blvd corridor inside the beltline.

Regarding high-rises in North Hills and nearby, the current zoning allows Kane to build high-rises as tall as 35 stories/365ft (residential buildings and hotels have normally shorter floors), without any special permits. This doesn’t exclude the possibility for something taller, but it has to get approval first. The vision includes 7 more buildings (4 of them in the North Hills East section) that seem to be anywhere between 10 and 30+ floors, so stay tuned. Also, Kane has acquired another 60+ acres of land between NHE and Wake Forest Rd, with the intention to develop them in a fashion similar to NHE.

If you want to compare Capital Blvd and North Hills, the former is more like a corridor and the latter seems to be more like a “neighborhood” center. Both have potential for urbanity and taller buildings, but they will always function differently. I think it will take a MUCH longer period for Capital Blvd, not only because it is a much larger area, but because too many different land owners control land along that corridor. I don’t expect to see much for another 30-40 years, though

Does anyone know how difficult it is for a developer to buy suburban houses? I feel like if the developer had a long time to wait (s)he could wait for houses to go on the market and slowly acquire houses. This seems like the only solution for the problem of suburban housing between North Hills and Downtown. Obviously this is a pretty long term scenario.

Ernest,

I just clicked on your name and I didn’t realize you were the curator of Raleighmsa.com. I check that site pretty often but there hasn’t been much for you to write about. Funny that I should meet you here.

Steve, slow acquisition is done, but the lack of money for lending is now the problem. There may also be restrictions applied by the subdivisions/communities. For example, when you buy your home you may be restricted to living there for at least a period of time, etc. Not to mention, it would take forever to assemble enough parcels to make a difference. Once the word is out, home owners will ask for astronomical amounts. North Hills East is a perfect example. There is an old couple that sold their home to John Kane (the developer) for $850,000. They knew he was desperate to finish assembling the land and they asked for the sky. Imagine what will happen if more and more people play the game this way. Urbanizing suburban neighborhoods would cost us a ton of money; the costs always get passed to the buyer.

As for my website, what a disgrace it has become I have done so many updates off-line, but nothing gets delivered. I am still working on some updated content, but we’ll see how long it will take this time. The New Projects (DT Raleigh) is pretty much up to date though.

George (and anyone else), I noticed on the Green Square webcam that they’ve been doing a lot of digging the last week or so in the area where the SECU building is supposed to go. They previously haven’t touched this area. Also, this afternoon the trees that were there disappeared. Perhaps they are starting SECU now…

Jeff, you are correct. Actually they started digging at the future SECU Building site 2 weeks ago but now it is clearer that they are moving forward. Can’t wait to see a third crane rising up there

Oh yea. I was wandering(wondering)? where the tower part of the building was going to go. Now i see in that corner, they dug out a lot more and cleared the land.

Ernest,

In your opinion, without asking for any details you might have, how likely is it that the mystery building you’ve previously mentioned is going to go up? Perhaps a better question is, how likely is it that the block between Wachovia and RBC is going to see anything of significance? I feel like that and the Hillsborough corridor between Glenwood and the Capitol are the two most likely areas to get any real development (since the Reynolds Tower is on a property the city clearly wants for a high rise and the Winston and One Glenwood developments are both on that corridor as well). Also, what is the likelihood that the area around Nash Square is redeveloped? I feel like that area, especially the south end, is a little underused. There’s no reason why the shops there would have to move (they could go into the bottom of a bigger development, like they’re doing with Clyde Coopers and Edison).

Steve, I can only offer speculations, as I have no evidence of any solid plans. Details on the “mystery tower” are still unavailable to me, or anyone I asked. I will go one more round of begging for info and I will let you guys know, provided they don’t ask me to keep quiet. There are two possibilities for redevelopment, as far as I can see. One is the Alexander Square parking deck. They can add up to 10 floors above it, and this idea has been brought up in the past. The second one is the First Citizens Bank corner, but then again we are not aware of any vision. I have a gut feeling that some day FCB may surprise us, but I am in the minority. The rest of those blocks have historic properties and I see little hope for anything major.

However, I do see massive potential along Salisbury and Wilmington Streets, as well as the Hillsborough Street corridor. It may take the completion of The Edison and One Glenwood before the potential becomes clear to all, but we’ll get there during our lifetime Nash Square is definitely a huge opportunity, but not for long, if developers bring us small projects, like The Hue. What a waste of space!!! Nothing against the project, just the location. The Hue would probably fit better in Glenwood South, or other Warehouse District locations.

I feel like the block just east of the Charter Square development is due for a large building or two. What makes you think First Citizens is going to do anything big? Do you have any idea why Sandman hasn’t released information or any statements that I can find about One Glenwood since 2007? Is it because of the down credit market? He said in 2007 they were in the design phase, well three years is certainly long enough to design one building. Any opinion on the likelihood of the Winston Towers going up? How long do you think it will be until work on Charter Square or Edison resumes? Are we likely to see the city try to move the Reynolds property or the Lafayette property in the next few years? If you had to predict, when would sites 2 and 3 get built and how likely is the new transit center to become reality? Assuming this mystery building is for real, how often do you hear about such buildings and then never see anything develop?

Steve, regarding the parcel you mentioned (East of Charter Square), you are right on the money. One of the owners is Empire Properties, which is not a traditional high-rise developer. Their problems with getting the L Building and Lafayette off the ground could very easily get passed on any future high-rise proposals by them. However, owning an empty parcel carries added benefits. They don’t have any deadlines to deal with. I hope we see something major by Empire Properties, some day.

So many questions, Steve!!! Let me try to answer all, as best as I can:

1) One Glenwood – Delays are due to many factors. The developer started small, with a 15-25 stories and about 200 condos (based on what I heard and read). Right now, this is the only “official” part. But, the designs revealed a major shift, to a 39-story building, with 64 residential units and 200,000sf of office space. Obviously, the current market forced this change. Sandman is a low-profile person, as far as I know, as opposed to the big “noise-makers” you see all over the newspapers and magazines.

2) Winston Tower – Unknown status. My guess is that they may be interested in getting something near the new conention center first. Let’s keep in mind that they wanted to offer their bid for the convention hotel, but they were late. If we see any activity (leasing) returning to the proposed site, then we’ll know for sure that nothing will happen for years.

3) Charter Square and The Edison – Most likely in the next 1.5-2 years. Charter Square developers are more hard pressed, though, because there is a contract with the city and the clock is ticking.

4) Sites 2, 3, 4 and 301 Hillsborough – Only God knows when we’ll see RFPs for those parcels. My guess, not earlier than 2-3 years from now. A bit longer to see anything rising there; maybe 5 years from now.

5) We don’t hear of mystery towers often. Not often, at all. Some people may argue about some of the proposals that have been stalled, or cancelled, but only one building qualifies as “pie in the sky”: The 20-story residential high-rise for the NE corner of Martin and Wilmington Streets. Even the 29-story First Citizens Banks HQ was for real – it failed because Two Hannover Square and Wachovia Capital Center were built at the same time, and we all know for how many years there was a ton of empty office space in downtown.

Oh, and the new Transit Center is a serious vision. The likelyhood of this happening in the next 5-6 years is good, but then again a lot depend on the debt the city leaders will add on Raleigh. This will probably be easier to finance with Federal funds, too.

I feel like the Transit Center could be something amazing, but it’s going to be ruined by the proximity to the prison and Boylan Heights. I think the Michigan Central Station in Detroit is a good example of what could happen, it’s around 20 stories or so. I feel like the whole WYE area should be eventually developed via air rights, which is what the Comprehensive Plan argues for. It’s a huge swath of land that should connect the area with the Bloomsbury to the Convention Center and seamlessly move into downtown. The problem now is that it’s not a very pleasant walk from that area to downtown, even though it’s only three blocks or so.

Steve, you echo the feelings of many people, although I am not as concerned about the impact on the new transit center by its surroundings. Boylan Heights is not a bad area. In fact, it is a historic neighborhood that is only getting more and more attractive. Sure, the prison will remain an eyesore and a very unpleasant fact, but I don’t think it will hurt the new transit center. As for the height, don’t expect much. I don’t think anything above 4-5 stories will be built. I can only hope for something functional that will not end up being a money pit. Inspiring design will be a plus

I definitely think Boylan Heights will be a problem. There will be so many nimbys against it. Its funny too because they all moved into a neighborhood bordered by a maximum security prison, train tracks, an insane asylum, railroad tracks and an area that we’ll just call “quaint”. But of course you’ll definitely hear from them and it wont be pretty.

The transit center will be a huge opportunity for Raleigh. It will be somewhat of a hub connecting the north to the south. I really hope we can seize the opportunity and build something that represents our city well for a long time.

JRD, you are right on the money about the NIMBYs. There is one piece of good news: the mayor lives in Boylan Heights and I am sure he will find a way – if he hasn’t already – to convince his neighbors about the added benefits from having a transit center nearby. If anything, it may bring additional police to the area, plus will remove some eyesores from the way. I bet a lot on that.

Where exactly would the transit center be located? Would it be in the middle of the whole triangle of tracks? I was thinking it would be cool if they made an impressive symmetrical design and built it to dead end Martin St. Kinda the way Fayetteville dead ends at the Capitol and Mem. Auditorium.

Pretty much the entire area in front of the Boylan Ave bridge. It will be bounded by Hargett Str, West Str, Dupont Cir/existing Amtrak station and Boylan Ave. There is potential for a creative design, but we’ll see how creative we’ll get with this project.

Being near the transit center will probably increase the property values of homes and land nearby. I don’t expect the residents of Boylan Heights to resist the project itself but I do see them being REALLY close to the decision making during the design of the facility.

Ernest, funny to see you mention the FCB 29 story. I have actually seen initial plans and presentation materials for it some years back. They went as far as space planning/leasing block diagrams for individual floors including their executive areas and boardroom from what I saw. I doubt they did any real construction drawings though as I am sure they were trying to line up some interest before proceeding. Like I said it was some time ago, not too long after the completion of Two Hannover and Capital Center. I could see them trying something downtown again at some point though. Mystery building maybe?

If the transit center is done right, it will be the best thing to ever happen to Boylan Heights. They will be connected to a true walkable area unlike pretty much anywhere else in the entre area outside of maybe 9th street in Durham.

Then again, considering the general attitudes of the masses here and the crappy “leadership” in the area, it will probably suck.

Lee L,

Regarding the FCB high-rise, I am one of the fortunate people out there. In fact, I have a rendering in my website and I happen to have in my possession one of the images they submitted to the city, courtesy of an old friend who worked at DRA. If that mystery tower is part of their future plans for a return to downtown, I will be ecstatic.

As for the envisioned transit center, I also want to see developers stepping up with some good ideas for redevelopment. We need dense residential developments to make that area safe and vibrant.

How soon before we see construction begin on a real high rise downtown?

I was able to visit Raleigh and I enjoyed the driving on 440…I think and seeing the Renaissance Hotel and the Cap Trust building. Hope to see more like that around the city…buildings above tree level.

Above tree level is good. They should make it a law here that a building has to be built at least twice as tall as it is wide at the base. Its an environmental issue, really.

n&o has an article on the new transit center today